Diesel fuel pump help!

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Diesel fuel pump help!

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Treacodactyl
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Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 25795
Location: Jumping on the bandwagon of opportunism

Posted: Sun Oct 02, 05 3:39 pm Post subject: Diesel fuel pump help!

A friend at work has a problem with her diesel Vauxhall Astra, 2 litre TDi. It is about 7 years old and the fuel pump has stopped working. Garages say the pump cannot be repaired and needs to be replaced at a cost of....ï¿½1500 - ï¿½2000! This means the car would probably be scrapped. I don't know much about diesels but gather this is the injector pump that forms a large part of the engine.

The only thing I can think of is an old pump from a scrapped car, but apparently they are very rare and as the costs of fitting will be high it may not be worth the risk. An independent garage and a Vauxhall garage have both said the pump cannot be repaired as it is electrical.

This seems a little extreme to me so does anyone know anything that could be done or any people who could help I would be grateful and it also doesn't seem sensible to scrap a whole car because of a single pump.

dougal

Joined: 15 Jan 2005
Posts: 7184
Location: South Kent

Posted: Sun Oct 02, 05 4:55 pm Post subject:

TD -
I spent a few minutes Google-ing around your friends problem.

It may well be that the Astra uses a Bosch VP44 injection pump - its used in the 2.0 Vectra.
This pump seems to have a 'fragility' when its not able to pick up fuel - caused by such things as a blocked filter, or an empty tank. In fact it seems *very* easy to wreck the pump after running out of fuel...

Anyway,
the VP44 weakness is discussed on this (USA) site
https://www.bluechipdiesel.com/VP44INFO.html

some folk in the UK should be able to rebuild the pump
(reckon about 50% of new price for the refurb & Vectra remove and refit is 5 hours labour - ï¿½250 labour? )
https://www.dieselbob.co.uk/injectionpumps.shtml

but the cheapest solution is likely to be fitting an extra conventional electric fuel pump to do the work for the part of the VP44 that seems to suffer.
A cunning modification, instead of a repair.
Its mentioned in this discussion (see Stu3000's post near the end)
https://www.cavweb-forums.co.uk/showthread.php?t=27338
Its also worth noting that that thread suggests these things are also subject to air leaks, which are probable very simply cured...

Might be worth checking first if it is a Bosch VP44...

*Both* garages having said *wrongly* that the pump *cannot* be repaired, it might be worth seeking out a Bosch specialist, (Or if its a Lucas/CAV item, then one of their specialists), primarily to determine *exactly* what the problem is.
Repairing such *electronic* (not "electrical") diesel injection pumps is a *highly* specialist job - but it *can* be done.
However, adding an extra (conventional) fuel pump should be within the scope of a many diy mechanics.

Treacodactyl
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Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 25795
Location: Jumping on the bandwagon of opportunism

Posted: Sun Oct 02, 05 9:35 pm Post subject:
Many thanks Dougal. She's had a few problems with the engine in the past and the garage hasn't helped much, possibly because they knew of the problems? I've printed off your details and she can decide what to do.

Jonnyboy

Joined: 29 Oct 2004
Posts: 23956
Location: under some rain.

Posted: Mon Oct 03, 05 9:10 am Post subject:
I have friend in the trade, I'll get him to price the job. Is it just the fuel pump which is fried?

Treacodactyl
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Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 25795
Location: Jumping on the bandwagon of opportunism

Posted: Mon Oct 03, 05 11:28 am Post subject:
Yes it is just the fuel pump. I don't know anything about diesels but I gathe the pump does much more than the petrol fuel pump. I'd wait until I can get some more details from the person with the problem like the exact make of pump. Thanks.

Bernie66

Joined: 14 Jan 2005
Posts: 13967
Location: Eastoft

Posted: Mon Oct 03, 05 11:47 am Post subject:
In my experience alot of garages that are not diesel specialists do not have a great understanding of the ways the engines etc work and usually go for a more expensive "fix-all" fix to the problem. Seek advice from a diesel specialist before committing to any fix

dougal

Joined: 15 Jan 2005
Posts: 7184
Location: South Kent

Posted: Mon Oct 03, 05 11:51 am Post subject:

Treacodactyl wrote:

Yes it is just the fuel pump. I don't know anything about diesels but I gathe the pump does much more than the petrol fuel pump.

The Diesel fuel injection pump was what made Diesel-engined vehicles possible. Previously Diesel engines required a supply of compressed air to "atomise" the fuel, whether coal dust, milk powder, veg oil or petrochemical fossil fuel.

But the injection pump (and hence Diesel vehicle) wasn't invented until 20 years after the death of Diesel himself. This fact alone calls into question all those statements about Diesel inventing something specifically to give people *transport* based on pure veg oil.
However that rant can wait.

The injection pump has to deliver an appropriate quantity of fuel at just the right moment (relative to the piston's stroke) at *very* high pressure.
Electronic types make all the quantity/timing adjustments by software, rather than the traditional mechanical methods. (Think of the adjustments in a petrol engine's ignition and carburation systems...)
But it would seem that the common problem with the Bosch VP44 used in some (all?) 2 litre Vauxhalls at around that time is in the part that replaces a conventional fuel pump - the "lift" pump, that tries to suck fuel from the tank into the high pressure precision stuff.
Which is why adding a conventional pump, to assist the lift pump, is a possible cheapish diy fix - but obviously only if the problem is with the lift pump within the "injection pump" assembly.
Hence the *need* for an accurate, specialist diagnosis.

Jonnyboy

Joined: 29 Oct 2004
Posts: 23956
Location: under some rain.

Posted: Mon Oct 03, 05 12:16 pm Post subject:
Bad news, ï¿½1500 is about right for a pump like this. Good news, he says they are readily available second hand.

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