Does hook size matter?

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Does hook size matter?
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Treacodactyl
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Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 25795
Location: Jumping on the bandwagon of opportunism

Posted: Mon Apr 11, 11 5:49 pm Post subject: Does hook size matter?

Within reason does the size of the hook matter too much? While perusing some mackerel feathers I noticed that they are often on quite large hooks, size 3/0, whereas the advice I've been given is to use a size 1/0 hook and I've got some lures even smaller hooks down to a tiny 6.

I know I tend to underestimate the size of mouth on a fish like a mackerel but size 3/0 hooks still look a bit large to me. Will they be fine, will they just catch large specimens or will they be yet another reason why I don't catch much!

dpack

Joined: 02 Jul 2005
Posts: 46207
Location: yes

Posted: Mon Apr 11, 11 6:27 pm Post subject:
i tend to use small strong hooks that hide in the bait apart from the sharp bit most premade feather traces are shoddy ,make your own is easy and fun

Bebo

Joined: 21 May 2007
Posts: 12590
Location: East Sussex

Posted: Mon Apr 11, 11 6:43 pm Post subject:

From my coarse fishing experience, the smaller the hook the bigger the number of bites but the lower the proportion that you'll land. But then I rarely used anything bigger than a size 16 and have been kniwn to use a 22 on occassion. I once landed a 7lb pike on a size 18 with a 2lb breaking strain hooklength. Pure fluke that it took a small roach I was reeling in and that its teeth didn't cut through the line.

Dabinett

Joined: 23 Dec 2010
Posts: 90
Location: Hampshire

Posted: Mon Apr 11, 11 6:54 pm Post subject:

If you're only after mackerel then it doesn't really matter too much. They can open their mouths pretty wide and they will hook themselves on pretty much anything.

However, with feathers there is a range of other species that will take them, so there is an argument for going smaller or bigger.

Things like garfish, launce, herring or smelt you would be better off going for small hooks, perhaps size 4 or 6. These will still get the mackerel but pick up the little species too (most of which make great live bait).

On the other hand, if you are in an area where bass, decent pollack or scad are about then you'd be better off with about a 3/0.

Personally I tend to go somewhere in the middle, around 1/0 give you a decent chance with everything.

And yeah, as said above, making your own is cheaper and better quality, and there are all sorts of things you can use. Just make sure you use strong hooks and about 50lb line for the rig body if you're beach casting.

dpack

Joined: 02 Jul 2005
Posts: 46207
Location: yes

Posted: Mon Apr 11, 11 7:18 pm Post subject:
small was not very specific for most things off the shore 8mm to 12 mm diameter point to shaft long shaft for feathers ,short for bait very strong ,well shaped to lock in,very sharp ,stainless steel hooks are my first choice

windyridge

Joined: 03 Oct 2010
Posts: 2732
Location: Up the garden from Henry

Posted: Mon Apr 11, 11 8:38 pm Post subject:
I thought that size mattered in all things

SmattyB

Joined: 26 Oct 2006
Posts: 127
Location: Just landed in Aarhus, Denmark.

Posted: Tue Apr 12, 11 6:44 am Post subject:

Agree with Dabinett, I've used size 12 launce feathers and caught bass up to 3lb (by accident) not ideal, but modern hooks are really good quality. 1/0 - 3/0 will cover most beach & rock fishing, long shanks for worm baits and short for fish strip & crab.

One note, stainless steel hooks are mentioned in the thread, I would steer well away from stainless steel. Carbon steel hooks rust to breaking point in salt water in a matter of a week or so. Stainless steel will last for a heck of a long time. if you loose gear, loose a fish in a snag or any other reason, it's best not to have it as a hazard for years.

M.

Bodger

Joined: 23 May 2006
Posts: 13524

Posted: Tue Apr 12, 11 7:01 am Post subject:

You miss the point, which is what the fish might very well do.

Hook sizes and designs of hook have been developed after decades of experience, inorder to catch particular species and sizes of fish. There is quite an overlap of course and while one hook may very well catch a variety of fish, you should try and use the right tool for the job.
From experience, too big a hook will lead to missed fish ( they can't fit it in their gob ) while too small a hook will also lead to missed bites too. The latter is because it doesn't have the power or is so small that its pulled out of the maw without coming into contact with anywhere to hook into. The other problem that using too small a hook leads too is the bait and hook being swallowed completely which often demands major surgery and unnecessary discomfort to your patient.

Treacodactyl
Downsizer Moderator

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 25795
Location: Jumping on the bandwagon of opportunism

Posted: Tue Apr 12, 11 7:07 am Post subject:
Thanks for the replies. So, erring on the smaller side sounds best as I know there's herring (do herring come close enough insure to catch from the beach?) about and I'm sure I've seen garfish. Thanks for the comments on stainless hooks, I often walk the beach at low tide and usually collect a few old rigs to throw away so I know what you mean.

Bodger

Joined: 23 May 2006
Posts: 13524

Posted: Tue Apr 12, 11 7:54 am Post subject:
In all my time fishing, i've only ever seen one herring caught on a hook. I'll be interested to hear how you go on.

dpack

Joined: 02 Jul 2005
Posts: 46207
Location: yes

Posted: Tue Apr 12, 11 8:23 am Post subject:

i see the problem with stainless but have not found the strength and shape needed in carbon steel (big wrasse can break carbon hooks they will bite etc ) and as i mostly slide float or spin or dangle i dont lose many hooks

re the swallow the hook issue ,it aint a problem to em once they are hauled in and bashed on the head ,i have a hook it eat it policy and do not fish catch and return on moral grounds , barbless lip hook is only fun for the (expletive deleted ) rod holder ,not the fish

i do not see fishing as sport ,it is hunting and as such i try to use the kit that gives the kindest kill which to my way of thinking is whatever gives a high chance of a fast kill once contact is established

ps i have collected much more kit than i lost ,very rarely buy leads,floats etc , i we make a rule to collect more than we lose we improve things and it is reduce and reuse
and collect miles of tangled mono ,nets etc

pps if using a weight to land on the floor a lead can be attached with a line weaker than the rig and main line so as if snagged the rig comes home and the weight stays out

Dabinett

Joined: 23 Dec 2010
Posts: 90
Location: Hampshire

Posted: Tue Apr 12, 11 7:48 pm Post subject:

Treacodactyl wrote:

Thanks for the replies. So, erring on the smaller side sounds best as I know there's herring (do herring come close enough insure to catch from the beach?) about and I'm sure I've seen garfish.

Thanks for the comments on stainless hooks, I often walk the beach at low tide and usually collect a few old rigs to throw away so I know what you mean.

What area are you fishing in, and over what sort of ground?

Treacodactyl
Downsizer Moderator

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 25795
Location: Jumping on the bandwagon of opportunism

Posted: Tue Apr 12, 11 8:22 pm Post subject:

Dabinett wrote:

Treacodactyl wrote:

What area are you fishing in, and over what sort of ground?

I'll be fishing in North Devon, the beach I'm most likely to fish has sand at very low tide, then a ridge of rocks which is covered by a couple of meters of water at high tide, and then very large pebbles. So I plan to float fish for mackerel and gars to start with.

Dabinett

Joined: 23 Dec 2010
Posts: 90
Location: Hampshire

Posted: Wed Apr 13, 11 5:41 pm Post subject:

Treacodactyl wrote:

Dabinett wrote:

Treacodactyl wrote:

What area are you fishing in, and over what sort of ground?

Sounds ideal for bass and pollack too:)

Moniar

Joined: 26 Jan 2009
Posts: 152
Location: Lampeter, west Wales

Posted: Sun Apr 17, 11 10:22 pm Post subject:

I always use the small multi coloured shrimp rigs which have size 1 hooks. I use it for mackeral, garfish, coalfish, codling, pollack, and baited up for dogfish and black bream.

I have caught 20 or so herring with the same rig in one session - fishing off the kayak in middle of the menai straits on xmas eve two years ago - you have to retrieve the line a bit more clowly as they tend to come off the hooks as their mouths seem to be soft. They are very tasty grilled or fried the same day - and I put a load in the freezer to use as bait for conger huss and thornback rays in the spring.

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