ROOFTOP GENERATION TO GIVE POWER - AND CASH

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ROOFTOP GENERATION TO GIVE POWER - AND CASH - TO THE PEOPLE

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Behemoth

Joined: 01 Dec 2004
Posts: 19023
Location: Leeds

Posted: Thu Jun 23, 05 8:37 am Post subject: ROOFTOP GENERATION TO GIVE POWER - AND CASH - TO THE PEOPLE

DTI Press release and consultation - do we 'Downsizer' wish to respond to it?

ROOFTOP GENERATION TO GIVE POWER - AND CASH - TO THE PEOPLE

Many UK households could one day be self-sufficient in energy needs and routinely make money by selling surplus electricity from home generators such as solar panels and micro-wind turbines.

This is among the possibilities raised by Energy Minister Malcolm Wicks as the Department of Trade and Industry asks for views on the development of "micro-generation" of low-carbon energy by homes, businesses and public buildings.

Launching the consultation in a speech to the Renewable Power Association's annual conference in London today, Mr Wicks will say:

"Power generation has traditionally been about giant stations supplying whole cities, but the future may show that small is big. Some generation will move closer to home - giving individuals and small communities the chance to contribute directly to the UK's long-term environmental and energy goals. There could also come a day when many people will receive a cheque alongside their energy bill."

The DTI is developing a cross-Government strategy for the development of micro-generation, including micro-hydro, micro-wind, solar power, fuel cells, micro-combined heat and power, and ground and air source heat pumps. Just how much can be done will depend on the costs and how they compare with other technologies.

Proposals are also outlined today for a grant scheme that could see a series of flagship low-carbon buildings over the next six years.

Malcolm Wicks will tell the RPA conference:

"Many people are keen to do their bit to help cut climate-changing emissions. They have the potential to make a big difference - nearly half of all UK carbon dioxide emissions come from buildings.

"This consultation will give people the chance to share their views on how we can best promote the development and uptake of micro-generation, and make it easier for people to adopt these technologies in their own neighbourhood. It's all about looking to the future but acting now."

Renewable Power Association Chief Executive Philip Wolfe said:

"At a time when some may be tempted to focus on 'big solutions to big problems', the DTI is to be congratulated for drawing attention to the significant contribution that micro-renewables can make to delivering the Government's overall energy efficiency and renewable energy targets.

"RPA member companies are at the forefront of the rapidly growing UK market for technologies that can literally put a power station on your own roof or in your own building. We are looking forward to working with DTI and other Departments to help deliver a successful long-term micro-generation strategy with all of the environmental, investment, innovation, export and job creation benefits that this will bring to the UK."

Green Alliance Director Guy Thompson said:

"Microgeneration could play a huge role in tackling climate change and meeting our future energy needs. Not only is it low or zero carbon but it engages people in the solutions to climate change. We therefore welcome today's publication of the government's microgeneration strategy as an indication of its commitment to the development of these technologies."

The launch of this consultation, together with last week's launch of the Carbon Abatement Technologies Strategy and the Hydrogen Strategy, is just part of the ongoing programme of work to implement the Energy White Paper and achieve the Government's goal of reliable, sustainable energy for all, delivered through competitive markets.

Notes to editors:

1. Micro-generation is the production of heat and/or electricity on a small scale, from a low-carbon source. Various technologies can be used, including: air source heat pumps, ground source heat pumps, fuel cells, micro-CHP, micro-hydro, micro-wind, bio-energy and solar (thermal and photovoltaic)

2. A full copy of the consultation document can be found on the DTI website at: https://www.dti.gov.uk/energy/consultation/microgen.pdf

3. The DTI is seeking views on a range of issues, including: how to support product development and deployment; how to improve communications; what the most appropriate economic incentives might be; the issues around building regulations and planning policy; technical matters relating to connection to the distribution network and metering; and the Low Carbon Buildings Programme

4. Responses from individuals and organisations are invited by 23 September, and should be sent to:

Rachel Crisp, Energy Strategy Unit, Department of Trade and Industry, 1 Victoria Street, London SW1H 0ET;
Fax: 0207 215 0300;
Tel: 0207 215 0303
Email: [email protected]

5. Following the consultation, the Government will develop a final strategy for the promotion of micro-generation, which will be published before April 2006, in compliance with the Energy Act 2004

6. The DTI is working on a cross-government micro-generation strategy as part of the work of the Sustainable Energy Policy Network (SEPN), a network of government departments, Devolved Administrations, regulators and other organisations that are jointly responsible for delivering the Energy White Paper's commitments.

7. The Carbon Abatement Technologies Strategy can be found on the DTI website at: https://www.dti.gov.uk/energy ; The Hydrogen strategy can be found at: https://www.dti.gov.uk/energy/sepn/hydrogen.shtml

Department of Trade and Industry
7th Floor
1 Victoria Street
London SW1H 0ET

Public Enquiries +44 (0)20 7215 5000
Textphone +44 (0)20 7215 6740
(for those with hearing impairment)
https://www.dti.gov.uk

dougal

Joined: 15 Jan 2005
Posts: 7184
Location: South Kent

Posted: Thu Jun 23, 05 12:10 pm Post subject:

Well, I can't download the PDF. I keep getting a message saying "resource not available".

I'm quite keen to discover HOW the DTI thinks heat pumps are going to act as generators...

Quote:

The DTI is developing a cross-Government strategy for the development of micro-generation, including micro-hydro, micro-wind, solar power, fuel cells, micro-combined heat and power, and ground and air source heat pumps.

Blue Peter

Joined: 21 Mar 2005
Posts: 2400
Location: Milton Keynes

Posted: Thu Jun 23, 05 1:23 pm Post subject:

dougal wrote:

I'm quite keen to discover HOW the DTI thinks heat pumps are going to act as generators...

Quote:

Isn't it that effectively you get out more energy (heat) than you put in, because you're taking some of the energy from the earth, just as you might take some of the energy from the sun or the wind? Admittedly in this case, you have to keep on supplying energy, whereas you don't with say a wind turbine (though you would with pumped solar water heating),

Peter.

dougal

Joined: 15 Jan 2005
Posts: 7184
Location: South Kent

Posted: Thu Jun 23, 05 1:50 pm Post subject:

Heat pumps harvest solar energy, either from the air, ground or water.
For a small temperature rise (eg underfloor heating) you should see over 4 units of heat produced for every unit of electricity consumed.
They are not cheap on capital cost, but can make financial sense for someone with enough land to "dig up" and no mains gas.

But they DON'T *generate* electricity - so in this context, I think someone has their 'wires crossed'...

Blue Peter

Joined: 21 Mar 2005
Posts: 2400
Location: Milton Keynes

Posted: Thu Jun 23, 05 2:01 pm Post subject:

dougal wrote:

But they DON'T *generate* electricity - so in this context, I think someone has their 'wires crossed'...

I expect that they're thinking of energy in general rather than electricity.

Also, you could look at it in that negative way in which using a heat pump means that you don't need to generate as much electricity (if you would otherwise heat your house by elastic trickery),

Peter.

dougal

Joined: 15 Jan 2005
Posts: 7184
Location: South Kent

Posted: Thu Jun 23, 05 2:28 pm Post subject:

Blue Peter wrote:

dougal wrote:

But they DON'T *generate* electricity - so in this context, I think someone has their 'wires crossed'...

... using a heat pump means that you don't need to generate as much electricity (if you would otherwise heat your house by elastic trickery)

Given that this is specifically about micro-generation not conservation, my money is on someone not having a clue what they're talking about!

PS still can't download the pdf...

dougal

Joined: 15 Jan 2005
Posts: 7184
Location: South Kent

Posted: Sun Jun 26, 05 7:41 pm Post subject:

Well, it seems someone at the DTI either can't upload a document or publish the correct URL...

ANYWAY
the consultation document CAN be downloaded from the BBC
https://news.bbc.co.uk/1/shared/bsp/hi/pdfs/23_06_05_microgeneration.pdf

The BBC News story has some other relevant links too
https://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/4122570.stm

At first glance, as strategies go, this one looks muddled.

Its a strategy for microgeneration of electricity, from renewable sources. And conventional ones too. And "microgeneration of heat". But not for the microgeneration of heat that every household already does. Just from renewables. And heat pumps too, 'cos maybe 3/4 of their heat comes from solar.

The only mention of insulation is to say that its already covered elsewhere.

The DTI, in Annex A of the consultation document, give their understanding of capital costs and payback times
Solar PV (2kw) �6,300/kw . 120 years
Electricity from Windpower (6kw) �2,500+/kw . 29 years
Micro Hydro �1,000 - �3,000/kw (so similarly probably much less than 29 years??)
Solar Thermal �2,500- �4,000 for 4m^2 giving payback in 24 years against electric heat and 80 years against gas

Ground Source Heat Pumps �4-6,000 for a "typical" (no size given!) installation "providing 95 to 100% of household heating requirements", but a 9kw installation would be �9,000

and would provide an annual saving of �640 over peak rate electricity, and "installation and running" costs would supposedly be "comparable" with oil fired installations...

Air Source Heat Pumps - a plug but no costs for this noisy technology
Biomass (ie log or chip wood-burners) �2,400+ for a "single room heater" or �200-�600/kw for a boiler system. Here again 9kw is described as "typical" and "Overall the running
costs would be comparable to gas or oil heated properties"

CHP no costs given
Fuel Cells and Hydrogen - no costs given.

My initial impression is that these figures are going to be used to justify support for uncompetitive technologies, rather than to demonstrate what is workable and worthwhile.

Blue Peter

Joined: 21 Mar 2005
Posts: 2400
Location: Milton Keynes

Posted: Mon Jun 27, 05 1:50 pm Post subject:

dougal wrote:

My initial impression is that these figures are going to be used to justify support for uncompetitive technologies, rather than to demonstrate what is workable and worthwhile.

I've just skim-read the document. I'm not sure that the figures for payback times could be used to justify much at all

I think that I'd conclude:

If you want to run things off micro-renewables, then probably the first step is a change of life-style;

Is micro-renewables the way to go? as opposed to, say, district-renewables? I would guess that there are a lot of scale factors involved in the use of renewables e.g. the scale involved with the energy desnity of their sources which is low compared to fossil fuels, (which means that you have to harvest from relatively large areas); the scale involved with building units to capture the energy , e.g. is it better to build many household units? or a few district units? or even a few mega units (as appears to be the case with wind turbines)?

Peter.

Blue Peter

Joined: 21 Mar 2005
Posts: 2400
Location: Milton Keynes

Posted: Wed Jun 29, 05 11:31 am Post subject:
Just seen the the New Economic Foundation has a new paper which says that micro-generation is the way to go: https://www.neweconomics.org/gen/uploads/sewyo355prhbgunpscr51d2w29062005080838.pdf I haven't had a chnace to read it yet, Peter.

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