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Jonnyboy

Joined: 29 Oct 2004
Posts: 23956
Location: under some rain.

Posted: Tue May 17, 05 9:18 am Post subject:
I have this idea about farming out pig buckets to my friends and using this as their food, thus avoiding buying proprietry feed. is this a bit fanciful?

tahir

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 45669
Location: Essex

Posted: Tue May 17, 05 9:20 am Post subject:
Dunno, but it sounds illegal

judith

Joined: 16 Dec 2004
Posts: 22789
Location: Montgomeryshire

Posted: Tue May 17, 05 9:27 am Post subject:
It is definitely illegal now. Pigs cannot legally be fed any form of post-kitchen waste. What happens to your scrap bucket between kitchen and compost heap is between you and your conscience though. Nick, your abbatoir costs seem very high - I've been quoted �25 per pig. Did you shop around or just go for the closest place?

Nick

Joined: 02 Nov 2004
Posts: 34535
Location: Hereford

Posted: Tue May 17, 05 10:21 am Post subject:

How much would you pay for a kilo of great pork? A kilo of Parma style ham? Sausages? It's hard for me to put a price on it, to be honest. Overall, I think we worked it out to be about a pound a pound cost. Even at that price, it's cheaper than crap Sainsbury's bacon at 1.99 for 6 rashers.

As for kitchen scraps, the law is very clear, and very fuzzy. You can't feed ANYTHING that's been in contact with meat, or meat products, so bread from a chicken sandwich is clearly illegal.

However, I can feed potatoes from the garden to them. Can I peel the spuds and feed them the peelings? Can I boil the spuds and feed them to the pigs? Can I boil the spuds for my family, and give them the ones I don't serve up? Can I feed them the ones my kids leave on the side of the plate?

It gets less and less clear. Personally, I obeyed it about meat, but excess pasta, peelings, left over spuds, etc went into them.

Slaughter costs were the most local abbatoir, who are only interested in killing animals who've travelled less than 40 miles, so they have a half decent welfare system. I was quoted, I think, about �30-�35 per pig, as long as they were below a fixed weight, which was, I think, about 70kg. Both mine were above that, so I had to pay more. The �110 included butchery at 25p/kilo. The full price should have been 38p/kilo, but I only wanted them in macro joints, so I could make my own sides of bacon, chops, sausages, full hams, etc etc.

This year, the pigs will be lighter, slightly younger, less fatty, and therefore less expensive. I like, and expect some fat on the meat, but if I'm honest, there was too much on some cuts. It gets left and wasted. That's pound notes going into the bin, and whilst cost isn't a driving force, it's stupid to throw money away.

Daydreaming

Joined: 12 Apr 2005
Posts: 291

Posted: Tue May 17, 05 11:10 am Post subject:
How would you ensure they were less fatty?

Joey

Joined: 03 Nov 2004
Posts: 191

Posted: Tue May 17, 05 11:43 am Post subject:

excellent article, Nick. Very interesting. What weight were the weaners when you bought them?
Am I right in guessing that they were 130-140kg liveweight when they went to slaughter??

Daydreaming wrote:

How would you ensure they were less fatty?

You would have to grow them slower by feeding less or by feeding
lots of bulky feed to reduce energy (calorie) intake.
Killing them younger would give a leaner carcase too.

If they were a commercial fast growing breed or hybrid they could be fatter if they were not given enough protein, but a standard pig feed nut would have plenty of protein for traditional breeds.

Nick

Joined: 02 Nov 2004
Posts: 34535
Location: Hereford

Posted: Tue May 17, 05 11:54 am Post subject:
I honestly couldn't tell you about weights, at delivery, or death.

Daydreaming

Joined: 12 Apr 2005
Posts: 291

Posted: Tue May 17, 05 12:03 pm Post subject:
What breed did you get?

Nick

Joined: 02 Nov 2004
Posts: 34535
Location: Hereford

Posted: Tue May 17, 05 12:47 pm Post subject:
This year, same as last, I went for OSBs. They did exactly what they said on the tin, so I figured there was no reason to change.

High Green Farm

Joined: 30 Nov 2004
Posts: 349
Location: Mid-Suffolk

Posted: Tue May 17, 05 3:33 pm Post subject:

tahir wrote:

Because some of the pics are pigs belonging to HighGreenFarm (thanks to both of you)

You're welcome!

Great article speaking as someone who has done the same recently.

One comment though: My reading of the law on feeding any waste to pigs is that it is crystal clear, that NOTHING should be fed that goes through your kitchen. Now, yes this may be an over the top protection for the average smallholder, and yes it may be completely daft. But I think people should be very careful about what they say in articles or posts about what they have or have not fed to their pigs.

The last thing any small time pig keeper wants is a visit from DEFRA, and I think this could be a very easy thing to happen.

Just my humble opinion.

Jonnyboy

Joined: 29 Oct 2004
Posts: 23956
Location: under some rain.

Posted: Tue May 17, 05 4:19 pm Post subject:
To clarify I was thinking about vegetable peelings, gone off milk and the like. Meat being a no no. Is that categorically banned under current legislation?

High Green Farm

Joined: 30 Nov 2004
Posts: 349
Location: Mid-Suffolk

Posted: Tue May 17, 05 4:33 pm Post subject:

See the link below....an extract is as follows.

"It is illegal to feed catering waste or animal by-product to any farmed animal or any other ruminant animal, pig or poultry. The term �catering waste� includes all waste food including used cooking oil originating in restaurants, catering facilities and kitchens, including central kitchens and household kitchens. This definition, therefore, includes all kitchens including kitchens where vegetarian foods are prepared."

https://www.defra.gov.uk/animalh/tracing/pdf/pig-new-owner.pdf

Nick

Joined: 02 Nov 2004
Posts: 34535
Location: Hereford

Posted: Wed May 18, 05 8:41 am Post subject:

Well, that's very clear. All I can say was that was published in June/July last year, and when I spoke to Defra and the trading standards bods earlier in the year, they couldn't tell me anything other than that it was illegal to make swill, or anything with meat contact. Thanks for finding and posting that, however.

And, if anyone from Defra is reading, 1) Make yourselves clearer, from the start next time, and 2) Clearly, I posted any confession as a test. I didn't really do it. At all. Not once.

On a related type note, one suggestion I was given was contacting local grocers and supermarkets, and collecting their waste veg to feed to the pigs. Apparently supermarkets are happy to do this, but there are (no, really) conditions. You have to sign to say it won't go for human consumption and you have to take it all (which may result, I guess, in a million tonnes of banananananas arriving for you). The latter point put me off, to be honest, that, and the fact that cost wasn't a premier issue for me.

High Green Farm

Joined: 30 Nov 2004
Posts: 349
Location: Mid-Suffolk

Posted: Wed May 18, 05 10:00 am Post subject:
I quite agree that what you get from Supermarkets, bakeries etc as waste can be fed to the pigs. One of these days I will get around to doing it myself!

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