One of them fans wot sits on a log burner.

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One of them fans wot sits on a log burner.
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Nick

Joined: 02 Nov 2004
Posts: 34535
Location: Hereford

Posted: Sun Sep 25, 16 5:22 pm Post subject:

joanne wrote:

Nick wrote:

joanne wrote:

We managed to get one today in one of our local Aldi's - Thanks Nick for highlighting this offer

Welcome. I couldn't find the other threads about them, tho. So I couldn't remember who wanted one.

Ps (just for you) Sisters of Mercy on tour...

I know so is the Mission with Pete Murphy and we are seeing The Cure in November

Bah, Mission, schmission. (But, yes, I have tickets to the other two)

jamanda
Downsizer Moderator

Joined: 22 Oct 2006
Posts: 35057
Location: Devon

Posted: Sun Sep 25, 16 6:22 pm Post subject:

joanne wrote:

dpack wrote:

what powers the thing to make it spin ?

Conduction I believe, as the stove heats up the fan begins to turns pushing the warm air out around the house

Convection I'd have thought.

Treacodactyl
Downsizer Moderator

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 25795
Location: Jumping on the bandwagon of opportunism

Posted: Sun Sep 25, 16 6:35 pm Post subject:

Jamanda wrote:

joanne wrote:

dpack wrote:

what powers the thing to make it spin ?

Conduction I believe, as the stove heats up the fan begins to turns pushing the warm air out around the house

Convection I'd have thought.

As the base is touching the fire the main heat source would be conduction wouldn't it?

Anyway, more details here: https://www.ecofan.co.uk/technical-information.html

dpack

Joined: 02 Jul 2005
Posts: 46233
Location: yes

Posted: Sun Sep 25, 16 7:07 pm Post subject:
i looked it up with nick's help above. conduction makes 2 different semiconductors hot ,that drives an electron flow across the junction where they meet, each has a wire that goes to the motor, that current drives the fan. very simple but rather clever

jamanda
Downsizer Moderator

Joined: 22 Oct 2006
Posts: 35057
Location: Devon

Posted: Sun Sep 25, 16 8:19 pm Post subject:
But a bit more complicated than I thunk. I assumed it would be like the tin foil fans we make at work and hang over the Bunsens.

Nick

Joined: 02 Nov 2004
Posts: 34535
Location: Hereford

Posted: Sun Sep 25, 16 8:37 pm Post subject:

Jamanda wrote:

But a bit more complicated than I thunk. I assumed it would be like the tin foil fans we make at work and hang over the Bunsens.

Nope. It doesn't need hot air. It needs hot contact to generate electricity.

dpack

Joined: 02 Jul 2005
Posts: 46233
Location: yes

Posted: Sun Sep 25, 16 9:29 pm Post subject:

there are a few examples of the two types being used in a practical way.

gas radio was part of the gas companies' fight back against domestic electrification ,they had cooking and lighting ,even fridges but radio was an electric thing most folk wanted and battery radios were very limited in amplifier power and batteries need swapping every few days so a gas radio could stop them getting electric and converting everything else . gas radio uses a single semiconductor hot at one end and cooled by fins at the other to drive the electron flow (same principle as the soviet paraffin radio sets).

the thermo-electric power units of early space satellites was similar but with heat from plutonium decay as the primary energy input on the hot end and the fins cooled by ir radiation into space. fun but not ideal at home.

before decent battery tech the same principle was used as a compact ,light power supply to run the targeting and steering electronics of some missiles with the heat coming from the solid fuel motor (and / or pre heating before launch ), and if they only need to work for a short time a heat sink does the cold end job , i dont know if it was used on bigger stuff that needed to fly for a while . im not sure if the two semiconductor type has been used for this but it could be.

these are a bit more advanced than the hot/cold sort in that the properties of the two different sides of the semi conductor unit have different free electron pressure at the same (quite warm ) temp and so don't need a cold part therefore being perfect for a stove fan

very very tidy for somebody to find a "simple" hi tech solution to making a low tech thing like a wood burner work far better.

Hairyloon

Joined: 20 Nov 2008
Posts: 15425
Location: Today I are mostly being in Yorkshire.

Posted: Sun Sep 25, 16 10:05 pm Post subject:
I'm a little surprised at how thin on the ground are Stirling engines for this kind of application. I've got one made principally out of cardboard and milk bottle tops. Obviously no good for a stove top, but it establishes the principle and the simplicity.

dpack

Joined: 02 Jul 2005
Posts: 46233
Location: yes

Posted: Mon Sep 26, 16 1:07 am Post subject:
stirling engines are another rather neat bit of tech but nowhere as tidy as these wee things

Hairyloon

Joined: 20 Nov 2008
Posts: 15425
Location: Today I are mostly being in Yorkshire.

Posted: Mon Sep 26, 16 7:31 am Post subject:

dpack wrote:

stirling engines are another rather neat bit of tech but nowhere as tidy as these wee things

Tidiness is overrated.

vegplot

Joined: 19 Apr 2007
Posts: 21301
Location: Bethesda, Gwynedd

Posted: Mon Sep 26, 16 11:46 am Post subject:

Hairyloon wrote:

I'm a little surprised at how thin on the ground are Stirling engines for this kind of application.
I've got one made principally out of cardboard and milk bottle tops. Obviously no good for a stove top, but it establishes the principle and the simplicity.

They're more expensive presumably because of their relative mechanical complexity compared to solid state versions.

Hairyloon

Joined: 20 Nov 2008
Posts: 15425
Location: Today I are mostly being in Yorkshire.

Posted: Mon Sep 26, 16 12:34 pm Post subject:

vegplot wrote:

Hairyloon wrote:

They're more expensive presumably because of their relative mechanical complexity compared to solid state versions.

Arguably they are no more complex, but they cannot be simply assembled from off the shelf components and simple castings.

Nick

Joined: 02 Nov 2004
Posts: 34535
Location: Hereford

Posted: Mon Sep 26, 16 12:57 pm Post subject:

Hairyloon wrote:

vegplot wrote:

Hairyloon wrote:

They're more expensive presumably because of their relative mechanical complexity compared to solid state versions.

Arguably they are no more complex, but they cannot be simply assembled from off the shelf components and simple castings.

Do they have more moving parts?

dpack

Joined: 02 Jul 2005
Posts: 46233
Location: yes

Posted: Mon Sep 26, 16 2:20 pm Post subject:

i recon a basic version could be adapted from a V or flat twin cylinder motorbike engine ,the magneto and a few bits of pipe.

ed ps im not manhauling that sort of thing around just to charge my phone and headtorch

a bi semi rig with a small "black box" to give a usable voltage could be a very toteable couple of hundred grams, certainly smaller than suitable ,current generation, pv panels with control gear and it works while you cook/make coffee etc even in a arctic winter or thick jungle

Last edited by dpack on Mon Sep 26, 16 2:30 pm; edited 1 time in total

Treacodactyl
Downsizer Moderator

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 25795
Location: Jumping on the bandwagon of opportunism

Posted: Mon Sep 26, 16 2:28 pm Post subject:

Midlandsman wrote:

If ALDI don't restock, you can get one for the same price here:

https://www.warriorstoves.co.uk/Catalogue/Fireside/Heating-Accessories/Stove-Fan-2-Blade-ELITE-19cm-Compact-Various-Finishes

Thanks for that. My Aldi sold out of 30 in a few minutes.

Does anyone know if some makes are better than others? I don't mind paying more for one that'll move more air around.

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