Hi after many years!

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Hi after many years!
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KingOfPlants

Joined: 17 Dec 2017
Posts: 5

Posted: Wed May 03, 23 3:06 pm Post subject: Hi after many years!

Just wanted to make my first post and say hi. I've been following this community for so many years but just wanted to introduce myself.

I've been gardening for as long as I can remember, I currently have an allotment in the north of England where I grow basically everything I eat in summer. Really excited with how things are already growing this year, I feel like it might be a good harvest this time. I've been striving to be as self sufficient as possible for so many years and I'm hoping with my next house move I'll be able to get a bit more land to get some animals which will be a huge step forward.

That's me anyway. Happy to be here after reading posts here for so many years. Thank you to everyone who has contributed in the past, hopefully the community will come more alive as we get towards the summer

Nicky cigreen

Joined: 25 Jun 2007
Posts: 9881
Location: Devon, uk

Posted: Wed May 03, 23 3:35 pm Post subject:
hiya

dpack

Joined: 02 Jul 2005
Posts: 46211
Location: yes

Posted: Wed May 03, 23 4:02 pm Post subject:
hello, we do still have quite a few keen growers and some folk who keep assorted critters, types of moo was a recent theme animals are ace and trouble some are just trouble, looking at ewe wooley nice you want to join in even after observing us apart from how to roast a potato most questions will find an answer

gz

Joined: 23 Jan 2009
Posts: 8918
Location: Ayrshire, Scotland

Posted: Wed May 03, 23 6:05 pm Post subject:
Hi from Ayrshire in SouthWest Scotland 🙂

jema
Downsizer Moderator

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 28234
Location: escaped from Swindon

Posted: Thu May 04, 23 5:58 am Post subject:
Good to have you onboard.

KingOfPlants

Joined: 17 Dec 2017
Posts: 5

Posted: Thu May 04, 23 10:35 am Post subject:
Thank you all for such a warm welcome

tahir

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 45669
Location: Essex

Posted: Thu May 04, 23 11:33 pm Post subject:
Hello

Mistress Rose

Joined: 21 Jul 2011
Posts: 15967

Posted: Fri May 05, 23 7:01 am Post subject:
Welcome. We don't have animals and probably never will, but do grow vegetables and have a woods where we do firewood, charcoal and a few other woodland related crafts.

Shan

Joined: 13 Jan 2009
Posts: 9075
Location: South Wales

Posted: Fri May 05, 23 11:08 am Post subject:
Hi and welcome! We used to have a smallholding in Wales but we are currently hopping between Portugal and Bristol. Trying to do some veg amongst our flower beds in Portugal because it would feel like such a wasted year if we didn't. Hopefully, if things pan out as we would like, we will be able to dedicate some proper time to veg growing come the end of the year.

Nicky cigreen

Joined: 25 Jun 2007
Posts: 9881
Location: Devon, uk

Posted: Fri May 05, 23 4:44 pm Post subject:

I'm actually a bit envious of you being at the start of the smallholding adventure.

I'm on the other side of it, my life has changed and I have had to change with it, but have kept sheep and pigs, turkeys and ducks, and chickens. Tried stuff, failed at stuff, succeeded at stuff, learnt and enjoyed the experience.
Now I am just growing veg and trying to be self sufficient in firewood and garden water.
But I say if you can, go for it

KingOfPlants

Joined: 17 Dec 2017
Posts: 5

Posted: Sat May 06, 23 8:21 am Post subject:

Shan wrote:

Hi and welcome! We used to have a smallholding in Wales but we are currently hopping between Portugal and Bristol. Trying to do some veg amongst our flower beds in Portugal because it would feel like such a wasted year if we didn't. Hopefully, if things pan out as we would like, we will be able to dedicate some proper time to veg growing come the end of the year.

With the rainy weather expected over the next week hopping to Portugal seems like a good idea!

Mistress Rose wrote:

Welcome. We don't have animals and probably never will, but do grow vegetables and have a woods where we do firewood, charcoal and a few other woodland related crafts.

That's amazing. Woodlands are such a peaceful and beautiful place. I'm a little envious for sure.

Nicky cigreen wrote:

Woah, that's quite a group of animals you had. That's a very similar dream to where I'm hoping to be in a few years. I do have some experience raising animals and miss it a lot. I just need to get more land to make some of the larger animals possible now, I can't have pigs and sheep in the garden

dpack

Joined: 02 Jul 2005
Posts: 46211
Location: yes

Posted: Sat May 06, 23 11:04 am Post subject:

pigs are delightful, well most of them (and they can be tamed or eaten youngish), the worst thing about pigs is the line between farm animal and member of the family animal can be easy to cross and impossible to recross for a fry up

ovinotechniphobia is a very reasonable response to experience of sheep, when they are not being psychopathic or "difficult" they are looking for unusual and interesting ways to die

co grazing sheep with good moos improves £per acre and the soil/flora of the pasture, it has a huge downside in sheep wrangling/nursing/stock disposal etc
there are a few places where sheep seem to be able to thrive with minimum input(harvest with a rifle) and they maintain that type of landscape

others will disagree, a few even like sheep

the hatred sheep have for me as an individual is powerful, they loathe and despise me even when they have never met me before, much like mosquitos go for some folk sheep are even more committed to hating me

Nicky cigreen

Joined: 25 Jun 2007
Posts: 9881
Location: Devon, uk

Posted: Sun May 07, 23 3:45 pm Post subject:
I suspect cows are a lot easier than sheep. But you do need more land for cows. I have 2 acres.. and was able to have all those animals comfortably, but it wasn't enough for cows.

dpack

Joined: 02 Jul 2005
Posts: 46211
Location: yes

Posted: Sun May 07, 23 6:24 pm Post subject:

moos have a lot of charm, but they are big to handle, they can be difficult or surprised, they can be clumsy or overenthusiastic etc, if they get scared they can be very active or uncooperative

they are not cheap(if they are, they will probably be very expensive)

the paperwork is less than simple

most need winter shelter

you need to have food all year, ie you need to buy or grow for winter fodder as well as happy pasture months

the land needs to suit moos, you still need to pick moos that will do best on a specific land and your husbandry regime

you need good fences and good neighbours

is there a footpath? the public are less than moo wise even if they live near moos

some moos are more docile than others

a few are downright dangerous even if you know why they are upset and you are really not guilty of what has upset them

no moo is safe, you can minimize the risks but carelessness costs lives

can you run, jump ,dodge? can you wrestle huge critters? do you want to at very short notice when you did not want to and still laugh about it?

have you got access to moo related transport? aim for zero miles but...
is there a decent local slaughterman/butcher? no would be a no moos for me

moo lore and handling can be learnt, learning will have many tense moments

having one is unkind, they need moo chums, a few is as much work as a few dozen

moos are nice, i lived with them for a few years and learnt as much as i could, including bull charming and a few handling skills as well as the welfare stuff

you need to be fit and sensibly brave, my first time in a tight pen with a few dozen of them was "different" and i am often quite bold

sooner or later there will be the first time something needs doing and it will scare you, or something will be a surprise you had no idea was possible

i would call my fistfight with the killerkerry a draw, neither of us enjoyed it, however i can claim to have stopped a moo charge with a palm strike
the newtonian physics of that was rather interesting and my backflip in the air and into a low kick position in the mud was a classic, i did have stress fractures to my arm and the moo had a headache

having moos can be interesting, happy excited highland boys, with long horns, scampering around a feeder while you try to open the big bale of lovely hay or roll out another layer of deep bedding is a game best played carefully
swerving a horn tip at knee ht from behind while avoiding the slower hoofy one on the inside of the breakfast spiral is the sort of thing that got glazed onto minoan vases

they kick, not as bad as horses, it hurts though
they are more likely to hurt you by accident
milk has issues for me unless 'tis as much as the calf needs and i will have what is left over
that said, milking is so calm the moral dilemma of doing a herod can get absorbed in a happy moo mist of warm flank and schhss bucket

i had been around moos all my life and even helped out a few times
living with and day to day wrangling of moos is very different and something that should not be done without consideration

hard to go too badly wrong with chooks and pigs, moos are nice, but they do have a few potential issues and they are high maintenance in one or more ways

moo margins are pretty tight if they need to earn their effort

KingOfPlants

Joined: 17 Dec 2017
Posts: 5

Posted: Sun May 07, 23 8:16 pm Post subject:

dpack wrote:

moos have a lot of charm, but they are big to handle, they can be difficult or surprised, they can be clumsy or overenthusiastic etc, if they get scared they can be very active or uncooperative

I think you have just said every reason why sheep are so much better for small scale

From my (limited) experience with cows it's often not the more difficult/angry cows that are dangerous because you are generally much more cautious around them. It's the friendly cows that seem to hurt their owners, not on purpose but they can be like giant overexcited dogs which can lead to them headbutting you, kicking, knocking ect by accident. I love cows so much but really do think they are best suited for people who have more experience and larger amounts of land.

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