Knock down or renovate?

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Knock down or renovate?

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Blue Peter

Joined: 21 Mar 2005
Posts: 2400
Location: Milton Keynes

Posted: Tue May 17, 05 11:07 am Post subject: Knock down or renovate?

Did anyone see Trevor MacDonald Tonight, last night (Mon16th May 20:00 � 20:30, ITV1)? The discussion was about whether it was better to knock old terrace homes down (18K) and then build new homes (120K or so); or to renovate the old terraces (cost, judging by the trailer for part 2 this coming Friday between 18 and 25K). Apparently, the plans are for about 200,000 homes in the North to be demolished and rebuilt.

I would have thought that from an environmental point of view, the renovation was certainly the way to go. Are there other factors which might influence the decision?

Peter.

Daydreaming

Joined: 12 Apr 2005
Posts: 291

Posted: Tue May 17, 05 11:12 am Post subject:
But new builds are horrid - absolutely souless! The old terraced houses are bigger, brighter and and on the whole better built. Now I'm thinking of Victorian terraces versus ghastly new builds.

tahir

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 45723
Location: Essex

Posted: Tue May 17, 05 11:19 am Post subject:

It's not always the case that replacement dwellings have a greater impact than refurbs, in most cases the new dwellings will be much better insulated and therefore efficient than the dwelling replaced.

Refurbs can also involve almost as much waste as replacement, in most cases most plastered surfaces are taken back to bare brick and in really old buildings both walls and ceilings will be replaced with plasterboard and skimmed, windows, floors, plumbing and electrics are also replaced. There's a lot of waste in all of that

Bernie66

Joined: 14 Jan 2005
Posts: 13967
Location: Eastoft

Posted: Tue May 17, 05 11:23 am Post subject:
At least with old houses you can't hear your neighbours stand up and walk across the room all the time. Or listen to soaps every night because they are!

tahir

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 45723
Location: Essex

Posted: Tue May 17, 05 11:27 am Post subject:
That's a different issue

Gervase

Joined: 17 Nov 2004
Posts: 8655

Posted: Tue May 17, 05 11:32 am Post subject:

What really does p*ss me off is the ludicrous tax situation where refurbs incur VAT and new builds do not.
There's another green issue to consider as well - cement manufacture accounts for 10 per cent of CO2 production on this planet, so if possible refurbish rather than build anew (and use lime-based mortars to be even greener). And that's to say nothing of the designed life-span of new builds. A decade ago the average builder quoted a 60 yar lifespan on the building; today in some areas it's down to 40 years!
Reduce, reuse and recycle, even with buildings!
(And join in the lobby to get VAT removed from renovations - go here https://www.writetothem.com/ and badger your MP)

Andy B

Joined: 12 Jan 2005
Posts: 3920
Location: Brum

Posted: Tue May 17, 05 11:37 am Post subject:

tahir wrote:

True, but you will still only be replacing parts, you will be wasting everything if you knock it all down and replace.

tahir

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 45723
Location: Essex

Posted: Tue May 17, 05 11:39 am Post subject:
I'm sure that in most cases there's a definite benefit in refurbing but that in others there's a case for replacement.

sean
Downsizer Moderator

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 42219
Location: North Devon

Posted: Tue May 17, 05 11:40 am Post subject:

tahir wrote:

I'm sure that in most cases there's a definite benefit in refurbing but that in others there's a case for replacement.

You want an excuse to build a house though.

tahir

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 45723
Location: Essex

Posted: Tue May 17, 05 11:44 am Post subject:
Sshh!

Nanny

Joined: 17 Feb 2005
Posts: 4520
Location: carms in wales

Posted: Tue May 17, 05 11:54 am Post subject: knock down or renovate

you don't think the trend to build new is anything to do with the fact that they can cram more houses in the same space in some cases then....................

i'm all for renovating myself if at all possible...give me the period features and keep the unique corner bath and modern low maintainence courtyard setting (barthroom too small and only a yard).............i know there are back to backs etc but even so i don't rate a lot of modern houseing estate houses..........

as you say there is now planned obsolecence even in the house building industry.

tahir

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 45723
Location: Essex

Posted: Tue May 17, 05 11:58 am Post subject:
The main reason that most developers prefer to "new build" is that they get significant kick backs for site clearance and then others to help with construction costs and as Gervase pointed out there's the vat issue to. Financially there's much more profit in new builds.

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